April, 1991
US Department of State Daily Briefing #52,
Monday, 4/1/91
Boucher
Source: State Department Deputy Spokesman Richard
Boucher
Description: 12:06 PM, Washington, DC
Date: Apr 1, 19914/1/91
Region: MidEast/North Africa, E/C Europe, South Asia,
Eurasia
Country: Iraq, Kuwait, Afghanistan, Albania, Lebanon,
Georgia, USSR (former)
Subject: Mideast Peace Process, Regional/Civil Unrest,
Development/Relief Aid, Refugees,
Democratization, Human Rights
(ON THE RECORD UNLESS OTHERWISE NOTED)
MR. BOUCHER: Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. I
hope you had fine holidays. Welcome back. I thought I'd just
update you on the unrest in Iraq, and then we can take any
questions you have and then go have lunch.
[Iraq: Civil Unrest Update]
Heavy fighting continues in northern Iraq between
government forces and dissidents. Kirkuk seems to remain in
government hands despite renewed fighting in that city late
Friday and Saturday. Over the weekend, government forces retook
Irbil and Dohuk. They have also moved against dissident forces
in the Zakho area along the Iraqi-Turkish border, but we cannot
yet confirm government claims to have retaken Zakho. The
government continues to send reinforcements into northern Iraq.
There has been some fighting in central and southern
Iraq. Yesterday and today, several areas north of Baghdad and
southeast of Kirkuk have been the scene of fighting between
government forces and dissidents. There has also been
additional fighting in the Basra area and in the general area of
the lower Euphrates and Tigris Rivers.
With that update, I'd be happy to take your questions.
Q They're still flying helicopters?
MR. BOUCHER: They continue to employ helicopters
against dissidents in both northern and southern Iraq.
Q Richard, the U.S. policy continues to be the same
regarding the helicopters?
MR. BOUCHER: U.S. policy continues to be the same.
Q Which is to say . . .?
MR. BOUCHER: Which is to say that the Pentagon has
expressed it repeatedly, and I'm not going to try to recreate
that here.
Q Richard, you mentioned fighting in central Iraq.
Is that new?
MR. BOUCHER: That is several areas north of Baghdad
and southeast of Kirkuk.
Q I'm saying, is this a new development?
MR. BOUCHER: No, I don't think it is.
Q Richard, do you have anything in response to those
who criticize the United States for not helping the rebels in
Iraq after all the statements made by President Bush and
Secretary Baker that the Iraqi people should move against
Saddam's regime?
MR. BOUCHER: We've gone over this repeatedly, and I
looked up today some of the statements that the President has
been making on this. I think he's made very clear the terms
under which our forces are present in Iraq; the things that they
would and would not do. He's made very clear what kind of
relationship we can have with a government that retains Saddam
Hussein in power. But he's also made very clear that we don't
think that we or any others, for that matter, should interfere
in the internal affairs of Iraq nor should we try to choose what
sort of government there should be in the future in Iraq.
That's for the Iraqi people to decide.
Q Even when commentators like Safire are beginning
to refer to it as a "sell-out?"
MR. BOUCHER: Our policy is decided on the basis of
what we think is in the best interest of the United States and
what the President decides to do. Not on the basis of
columnists.
Q The President also has made it clear that it's not
acceptable in the eyes of the United States for Iraq to use
helicopters in these combat operations against the rebels, has
he not?
MR. BOUCHER: Again, I refer you back to what he and
the Pentagon have both said. Neither one of them, I think, have
threatened specific action on the part of the United States.
Q Richard, has the Administration received a formal
plea for help from the Kurds?
MR. BOUCHER: I'll have to check on that. I'm not
aware of anything, but I better check.
Q I believe there was a story this morning about
Barzani, one of the Kurdish leaders, saying that letters had
been sent?
MR. BOUCHER: I'm not aware of any specific letters,
but let me check on that and make sure that we haven't received
any letters.
Q Can we go back to central Iraq? Who's doing the
fighting in that area?
MR. BOUCHER: What do you mean, "Who's doing the
fighting?"
Q Is that Kurds and the Baghdad government, or is it
Sunnis? Do you have any reports of Sunnis defecting from the
government and taking up arms? Or is the rebellion so far a
Kurdish-Shi'ite operation?
MR. BOUCHER: I think I'll have to check and see if I
can get into that level of detail. As far as I know, the
fighting between Baghdad and in the area around Kirkuk has been
with Kurds.
Q Richard, there are sort of impromptu refugee camps
behind American lines in southern Iraq. When the U.S. forces
pull out, has any thought been given to what's going to happen
to those people?
MR. BOUCHER: I can't give you specific plans at this
point. As far as the people who are there now -- the U.S.
military, the Kuwaiti Red Crescent, I think some other
international organizations are in that area taking care of
people. We are in touch with various international
organizations that would have a role in taking care of refugees
in that area.
Q Is there any agreement to the security of those
camps once the American forces leave?
MR. BOUCHER: Again, I can't give you any specific
plans at this point. I don't think it has been firmly settled
to that point yet.
Q Richard, there were reports Friday and Saturday
that the Administration is reassessing its position on not
receiving Kurdish dissidents. Have you heard anything about
that?
MR. BOUCHER: Well, Margaret, addressed last week our
willingness to give due consideration to requests that we might
get. At this point, we do have some requests. We've received
several meeting requests from Iraqi opposition figures. We're
evaluating those requests. We anticipate that some meetings
probably will take place this week and probably with officials
of the Near East Bureau.
Q Not with the Secretary?
MR. BOUCHER: At this point, it's not scheduled.
There's nothing scheduled at this point for any meetings with
the Secretary.
Q At what level in the Bureau?
MR. BOUCHER: Again, that's what we're evaluating, and
we'll determine what's the best use of their time and our time.
Q Will the scope go beyond the announced scope of
the previous meeting, which was strictly human rights
considerations?
MR. BOUCHER: That remains to be seen, depending on the
individuals involved. I'm sure we'll discuss a fairly broad
range of things with them.
Q How many requests have you gotten and from whom?
Q What types?
MR. BOUCHER: I'm not familiar with all the requests.
There are requests from various Kurdish representatives. I
think some of them are Kurdish-American groups who are
interested in talking to us. As Margaret indicated last week,
we are interested in talking to them. As I've said, we expect
to have some meetings here this week, but we're still in the
process of evaluating them and setting things up. So I can't
say specifically who we're going to talk to about what and when.
Q Why has it taken the State Department so long to
even begin to consider these kinds of meetings. Perhaps earlier
in the process it might have done these groups some good to talk
to the U.S. Now that they're getting the living daylights
kicked out of them in the north, suddenly, the Administration is
contemplating meeting with them. What's the point?
MR. BOUCHER: Again, Margaret addressed this last week.
As far as I'm aware, before she made her statement, we really
hadn't gotten any requests, or had only gotten a few requests.
We had met with some Kurdish representatives, including
Kurdish-American groups at various levels. After Margaret
talked about it last week, we got a series of requests that
we're looking at right now.
Q Those meetings are confined to Washington. Are
you planning any meetings in the region -- the Gulf itself?
MR. BOUCHER: I don't know exactly what meetings have
been requested -- in the Gulf, or in Europe, for example, where
some of these groups are located. The policy would apply to
both places.
Q Richard, Margaret had said specifically that the
Secretary would be willing to entertain such requests. The
requests that you have on file now, were they specifically to
meet with NEA, or has anybody asked to meet with the Secretary?
MR. BOUCHER: I don't know.
Q Are they limited to Kurds -- these requests?
MR. BOUCHER: Let me check on that. The ones I've
heard about have been Kurdish people or Kurdish-Americans.
Q Is the Administration thinking of providing aid or
reassessing, at least, that policy of not providing aid? I'm
thinking not necessarily of lethal aid but other -- money, for
example, intelligence, things like that?
MR. BOUCHER: I don't have anything new, and I think I
just repeated the things that the President has stated before,
that we don't think it's for us to try to choose or to influence
and decide on the future leadership of Iraq. We think that
people from outside should not become involved.
Q Paul Wolfowitz was quoted last week saying that
"No one in the Administration had a policy for these post-war
developments." If that's more or less accurate, what exactly is
it that you intend to discuss with any of these organizations?
MR. BOUCHER: I'm afraid I haven't seen that quote from
Paul Wolfowitz. So I'm not in a position to address it. I
think the Pentagon might be able to tell you whether it's
accurate or not. But in any case, we do have a policy. It has
been enunciated by the President.
Our views of the future leadership of Iraq. The fact
that it would be near-impossible to have normal relations with
the United States if Saddam remains in power have been clearly
enunciated by the President.
Q Richard, can you bring us up to date on the U.N.
vote?
MR. BOUCHER: The members of the Council are examining
the text, and we want swift action by the Security Council in
adopting this resolution. At this point, there are no formal
meetings scheduled today.
Q Can we go to Israel?
MR. BOUCHER: You can go anywhere you want to, George.
Q Do you have anything to say about the plans for
deportations and other types of restrictions on Palestinians?
MR. BOUCHER: What we've seen so far have been the
press reports of decisions, I guess, on security that were made
by Israel over the weekend.
Our Embassy in Tel Aviv will be seeking more
information from the Government of Israel. In general, I would
note, as we have in the past, that as a matter of policy Israel
should be looking for ways of developing dialogue and trust with
the Palestinians, not imposing new restrictions.
Q Richard, back to the Kurdish meetings, if I may?
Q Do you feel they're doing that, though? Can I
just follow that up? Do you feel that that's the direction
Israel is now headed?
MR. BOUCHER: Again, our Embassy in Tel Aviv will have
to follow up on this and see exactly what these restrictions are
-- if they are as reported and what they mean.
Q There have been other events, too. There was that
reported "Shoot to Kill" order last week which apparently over
the weekend was followed by the shooting of at least three young
Palestinians. Are you bringing that up? Are you now convinced
that there is such an order?
MR. BOUCHER: That, I assume, will be discussed by our
Embassy in the context of finding out about the discussions over
the weekend, since originally the "Shoot to Kill" order, as it
was called, was reported by different people, different
statements made by government ministers. But then it was said
that that would be among the subjects discussed at the Security
Cabinet meetings over the weekend, and that's what the Embassy
is going to be inquiring about.
Q Richard, can I go back to the U.N. situation for a
moment? Why is it taking so long to get agreement on this? I
realize it's been a holiday weekend, but why is it taking so
long to get agreement on a text which had been virtually agreed
upon by the Permanent Five before the holiday recess set in?
I was also struck by your language in saying that we
want swift action. Is there some indication that there's not
going to be swift action on this?
MR. BOUCHER: I wouldn't draw that conclusion. I would
just want to reiterate that we are pressing for adoption of a
resolution as soon as possible; that we have been discussing
this with other countries, as I think you've seen from the
various reports that have emerged, without my confirming any
details. There are a number of elements in the resolution.
It's long. It's a complex resolution, as these things go, and
we're working out various pieces of final detail with all the
various people that have to look at it.
We established broad agreement by last Friday with the
Permanent Five, but they and the other members of the Council
still have to work out some of the details in the text. It's
just a long thing that has to be worked through with everybody.
Q Some members of the Security Council have
expressed concern about the broad-reaching nature of this, and
the fact that it impinges on the sovereignty of certain member
states. Is that a valid concern in the view of the United
States?
MR. BOUCHER: Well, obviously, we think that everything
that we've discussed with other countries in terms of putting in
the resolution is called for, and that we see the resolution as
one that can complete and further carry out the mandate that the
United Nations has given to us and to other countries through
this previous resolution. And we see the steps that we put in
the resolution as ways of ensuring complete and full Iraqi
compliance with the terms that have been laid out previously by
the United Nations.
Q You mentioned their willingness to meet with
Kurdish rebel representatives. In principle, are you also
willing to meet with representatives of the Shi'ite rebels?
MR. BOUCHER: Yes.
Q And one other point, are you able to confirm or
comment on the story that 20,000 American troops are about to be
withdrawn from southern Iraq?
MR. BOUCHER: That's something I have to leave for my
colleagues at the Pentagon.
Q Can we switch to the Soviet Union?
MR. BOUCHER: Sure.
[USSR: US Embassy Fire Update; Services Restored]
Q I wondered if you had any more about the fire and
what might have caused it, and what the Embassy personnel are
doing now for work space.
MR. BOUCHER: I don't have anything more for you on the
cause. The Department's fire damage assessment team has arrived
at the Embassy. They are focusing their efforts on making the
building usable, at least in part.
The Embassy is setting up work space in Embassy housing
for some personnel displaced by the fire. Limited Consular
services were re-established today, although the Consular
Section still has no working phones. I'm told these Consular
services, which are some basic visa and American citizen
services, are set up out of the ground floor of the existing
building -- the one where the fire was. There were some areas
there that didn't have much damage.
We think it will be some time, however, before the
central section of the Embassy can be used again, and the
Embassy is making an intense effort to restart basic Consular
services and to do refugee interviews.
Q How about secure communications? Have you
re-established them yet?
MR. BOUCHER: I've been asked not to talk specifically
about our ability to communicate with our Embassy.
Q You can't even say "yes" or "no"?
MR. BOUCHER: So I can't even say "yes" or "no."
Q It sounds like it's "no."
MR. BOUCHER: I wouldn't draw that conclusion, Carol.
Q Is there any thought of using the new but bugged
Embassy? I mean --
MR. BOUCHER: At this point, as I said, the Consular
Section is working out of some of the lower floors of the fire
damaged building. We've set up some offices in different
facilities that we have in the new Embassy compound -- not the
new office building itself -- and I think I said last week that
that structure work had not progressed far enough that it was
usable, even if you discounted any security concerns.
[Lebanon: Return of US Embassy Staff]
Q Another subject: Anything about the meeting
between the U.S. Ambassador in Beirut and the head of the
government?
MR. BOUCHER: Ambassador Crocker and a limited Embassy
staff returned to the U.S. Embassy in Beirut on Saturday, March
30. The return is confirmation of our strong support for an
independent Lebanon, free from non-Lebanese forces and militias.
He has been meeting so far with government officials, including
President Hawari.
Q Nothing about the hostages?
MR. BOUCHER: No.
[USSR: Elections in Georgia]
Q Also on the Soviet Union, any comment on the
election yesterday in Soviet Georgia?
MR. BOUCHER: We've seen from press reports that 80
percent of Georgian voters participated in the referendum, and
that 90 percent of those voting reportedly were in favor of
independence. As we've said before, the distribution of roles
and responsibilities between Soviet republics and the Central
Government is an issue for the Soviet people to decide. It's a
complex question that we hope will be resolved democratically
and on the basis of peaceful discussions by the concerned
parties. And we believe, obviously, that the results of this
referendum should play a role in that process.
Q Can you say anything about General Scowcroft's
trip to the Middle East?
MR. BOUCHER: No.
Q Do you have anybody from the State Department
accompanying him?
MR. BOUCHER: Again, I don't have anything to say
beyond what the White House has said, and I'll refer you to them
to say it.
Q Why the veil of secrecy over a high-ranking U.S.
official flitting around in that part of the world?
Q Are we going to find out afterwards?
MR. BOUCHER: I'm afraid that the travels of General
Scowcroft is a question that's best addressed by our colleagues
in the White House, and they will say as much or as little as
they determine appropriate.
Q Are there any toasts this time? (Laughter)
Q Richard, back on the Soviet Union, do you have any
assessment that -- or does the government have an assessment you
could share with us about the kick-in of price increases
tomorrow, and what effect it might have on the stability of the
Central Government?
MR. BOUCHER: That's a pretty big question. I don't
have anything specific for you on that. I think we've always
expressed our view that economic reform was necessary, and that
prices are a key component of economic reform, and that these
things have to be done in such a way as to further economic
growth and to further economic opportunity.
[Albania: Election Update]
Q Do you have any comment about -- apparently the
Albanian Communists have won the election.
MR. BOUCHER: Albania. On Sunday, the Albanian people
voted for members to the new 250-person Parliament in the
nation's first multiparty election since 1945. According to
official accounts, 96 percent of Albania's 1.9 million eligible
voters cast ballots. Unofficial reports of the initial election
results indicate that the ruling Communist Party won heavily in
the countryside, while the opposition Democratic Party scored
impressively in Tirana and other major cities.
U.S. diplomats, private American observers and other
foreign election observers are meeting today to assess the
electoral process. We have some initial reports from our people
that are out there, but nothing that would lead me to any
conclusions that I can share for you on the conduct of the
elections. So we're awaiting the results of those discussions
with other observers, and waiting to hear what public statements
observer groups may want to make.
I'm told the official vote count is to be announced
later today or on Tuesday, so we don't have any comment at this
point on the results.
Q Can we return just a moment to Iraq? Two
questions: Do you have a comment on the tactics or the general
level of force that is being used by the Iraqi government to
suppress opposition movements? You have expressed, for example,
in the context of other countries, that it is all right to use
force to maintain the integrity of the country?
Is the kind of force that is being used in Iraq
acceptable to the United States, number one?
MR. BOUCHER: As for the characterization of the force,
I think we've characterized it in the past, noting specifically
that very heavy equipment was used by the government; that there
was indiscriminate shelling in many cases, some of which in the
past has damaged holy sites -- a lot of heavy armor and
equipment being used against civilian groups and rather
indiscriminately.
[Iraq: Human Rights Concerns]
We have for many years expressed concern about the way
the Iraqi government treated its own people, particularly its
overall abysmal human rights record, and I think in the present
instance, that as government spokesmen -- I'm thinking of some
of the White House briefings last week, in addition to what
Margaret has said -- we have expressed our concerns about
civilian casualties during the current strife, and our
condemnation of any atrocities or violence being used. We don't
believe that the Iraqi regime can in fact solve its problems
with its own people by violent suppression.
Q And do you see a trend at this point that the
government appears to be once again getting control of the key
cities that it had lost? It appeared for a while it was going
to get control, it lost again. Where are we in the pendulum?
MR. BOUCHER: It goes back and forth. I think I
reported today on some of the areas where the government appears
to be in control or where, through heavy assaults it started on
Friday, it appeared to have regained control. But in fact even
in some of those areas, there is some heavy fighting continuing
in the north. There are fighting clashes that continue to be
reported in the south. So the situation is by no means stable.
Q Do you have any assessment of the stability of the
current regime? Any reports of activities that might lead to a
change at the top?
MR. BOUCHER: I have no specific reports like that,
John.
Q Richard, on Afghanistan, with the fall of the city
of Khost, what's the U.S. view of what impact that might have on
the peace process, and do you have any comments at all on that?
MR. BOUCHER: That's something I'd have to look into
and see if we have any assessment like that for you.
Q Richard, do you have anything on the development
of the negotiations between the United States and a number of
Gulf states for a permanent headquarters in the area?
MR. BOUCHER: No, I don't.
Q Are they underway or what?
MR. BOUCHER: Well, I know we're still in contact with
the countries of the region about all the basic areas that we've
been pursuing after the war. Anything specific on the forward
headquarters for CENTCOM, I guess, would really have to come out
of the Pentagon.
Q Richard, do you have anything on the Secretary's
activities over the weekend while he's been down in Houston?
MR. BOUCHER: I don't think there have been any
particular activities on the foreign affairs side to report to
you. He's been spending the weekend with his family.
Q Richard, does the installment of a peacekeeping
U.N. force along the Iraqi-Kuwaiti border depend on Iraq's
acceptance of the cease-fire resolution?
MR. BOUCHER: Margaret talked last week about the
conditions that would lead to the withdrawal of our forces from
southern Iraq, and that remains unchanged. As for how the
resolution specifically deals with the deployment of a U.N.
observer force, I'm afraid I can't get into that sort of detail
on the resolution at this point.
Q Are you able to answer the question of whether
Iraq has to accept it for that observer force to be installed?
MR. BOUCHER: That would put me in a position of going
into certain details of the resolution that I can't go into at
this point.
Q Richard, is there anything new today on the
various meetings that went on in South Africa over the weekend
or the violence? Do you have anything?
MR. BOUCHER: We have always expressed our hope that
the leaders of various parties in South Africa could get
together and could act to restrain the violence and reduce the
level of violence and our deep concern about some of the attacks
and violent incidents which have taken place.
We'll have to see if these meetings over the weekend
can lead to that kind of result.
Q Are you encouraged by the fact that meetings have
taken place?
MR. BOUCHER: We're always encouraged that people
recommit themselves to lowering the level of violence, but I
think we'll have to see if they can actually achieve that.
Q On the Kurdish thing, if I may, I just want to
make sure: Are we talking about Kurdish leaders in exile as
well as Kurdish rebels fighting Saddam's forces? And, if you're
talking about the rebels talking to U.S. representatives, what
are the mechanics, because the airfields are controlled by
Saddam Hussein's forces, I understand, so they would have to get
into U.S. occupied territory and fly out of Iraq if they want to
talk here in Washington.
MR. BOUCHER: I don't at this point have a specific
list of people who have asked for meetings, nor do I know
exactly where they're coming from. I mean, the travel
arrangements would really be for them to set up, depending on
where the meetings are held.
[Albania: Resumption of Relations]
Q On Albania, what is the status of negotiations to
establish diplomatic relations with Albania, please?
MR. BOUCHER: We announced the resumption of relations
several weeks ago and signed a memorandum of understanding to
that effect. The people that we have out in Albania right now
are a small team of U.S. diplomats who are looking at the
physical setup to see how we can go about establishing a
permanent presence there, getting buildings, and that sort of
thing.
They are also, obviously, paying attention to the
developments there. They've been meeting with foreign ministry
officials, opposition party leaders, and others.
Q Speaking of meetings, any meetings with Iranian
officials on things other than the Claims Tribunal?
MR. BOUCHER: None that I'm aware of. No.
Q Thank you.
MR. BOUCHER: Thank you.
(The briefing concluded at 12:32 p.m.)