US Department of State Daily Briefing #48:
Monday, 3/25/91
Tutwiler
Source: State Department Spokesman Margaret Tutwiler
Description: 12:05 PM, Washington, DC
Date: Mar 25, 19913/25/91
Category: Briefings
Region: MidEast/North Africa, Subsaharan Africa,
South America, East Asia, Eurasia
Country: Iraq, Kuwait, Israel, Jordan, Iran, Cambodia,
Japan, Colombia, South Africa
Subject: Mideast Peace Process, Trade/Economics,
Refugees, Military Affairs, Human Rights,
Security Assistance and Sales, Democratization,
State Department, Travel, Regional/Civil Unrest
(ON THE RECORD UNLESS OTHERWISE NOTED)
MS. TUTWILER: I don't have anything specific today.
I'll be happy to try to answer any of your questions.
Q Do you have anything on the Israeli deportation of
Palestinians?
[Israel: Deportation of Palestinians]
MS. TUTWILER: Yes. The United States deplores this
decision by the Government of Israel. We have protested this
decision in Washington and in Jerusalem. Ambassador Kelly spoke
with the Ambassador to the United States from Israel on Sunday
and Ambassador Brown has raised this at the Foreign Ministry. I
could not get for you in time for the briefing exactly who
Ambassador Brown spoke with.*
Deportations are a violation of the Fourth Geneva
Convention as it pertains to the treatment of inhabitants of the
Occupied Territories. The United States believes that charges
of wrong-doing should be brought in a court of law based on
evidence to be argued in a public trial.
Israel's decision to deport Palestinians at this time
cannot possibly contribute to the development of a peace
process. We hope the Government of Israel does not go forward
with this decision.
Q I presume by your comments, then, that the United
States does not consider this to be one of the gestures that
Secretary Baker was looking for?
MS. TUTWILER: Not exactly. Correct.
[Middle East Peace Process: Follow-up by Secretary
Baker]
Q Would you say that this illustrates anything about
the Israeli government's attitude toward the initiative
Secretary Baker was trying to put forward?
MS. TUTWILER: I don't want to draw that conclusion,
Ralph, at this time. We've stated that we deplore this, that we
have protested it in both our capital and in their capital.*
* Ambassador Brown in Tel Aviv raised the issue in a telephone
conversation with the Director General of the Foreign
Ministry.
I have pointed out that it does not contribute toward
developing a peace process, but I don't want to go further in my
characterizations by drawing further conclusions.
Q As you know, the Secretary told us on the way back
from his trip that he expected to be in contact last week with
the area governments on certain specifics which he had offered
them and asked them to consider. We have as yet heard nothing.
Can you tell us anything about what the Secretary heard?
MS. TUTWILER: I have checked the literal transcript
and he used the word "probably" in referring to the week that we
were discussing. I know you hate our being so literal, but that
is what he said.
Last week, as you know, and Richard reported to you
daily, he did not speak personally with any foreign ministers.
Richard reported that ideas were being exchanged at a different
level. That still continues.
I would like to point out two things. One, this is not
the only thing on the Secretary of State's portfolio. For
instance, today, he has spoken with the Foreign Minister of the
Soviet Union concerning the U.N. resolution. He has calls into
the Foreign Minister of the United Kingdom and the Foreign
Minister of France.
He was having dinner last night with the President, a
working dinner with the President of Italy. He spent Saturday
at Camp David with Present Ozal of Turkey. He had any number of
foreign counterparts here last week working on any number of
subjects.
For instance, when he met with his counterpart from
Morocco -- I believe it was on Friday -- "Did they discuss his
trip to the region? Did he go over the four areas of concern?"
Absolutely.
One other point I'd like to clarify is that I cannot
promise you that every time he talks to a foreign minister on
this subject that I am going to be able to come down and report
it to you. He wants -- starting from this day forward, there
have been no conversations -- to be be able to, as I think is
certainly justifiable, to have phone conversations that do not
instantly have to be reported to the press by me.
Q That's fine. Is there any progress?
MS. TUTWILER: I can't say that there is any progress
but I can't say that at this early stage it was anticipated that
there would be concrete things that would be done.
I would also point out that tomorrow he will be seeing
Osama (el-Baz) who is visiting with Dennis here this afternoon,
so there's a specific, literal meeting for you. He will
continue to work on this.
I haven't read anything that has leaked, so far, from
any government in the region that he discusses specifics with,
which is quite amazing in my opinion, and shows how seriously
all governments are taking this. I believe this also shows they
are doing some serious, genuine thinking about the proposals and
specifics that the Secretary raised with them, most of which, as
you know, were raised one-on-one at the head of state level.
So I would anticipate that at not only Secretary
Baker's level but at other levels, people will continue these
conversations and they will continue a back-and-forth. And,
yes, at some time, obviously, he will be talking to his
counterparts.
Q Margaret, do you have any comment on the Iraqi
Cabinet reshuffle?
MS. TUTWILER: No, the President made a comment on that
on Saturday. I'd just refer you to what he said. Basically, I
believe, to paraphrase the President, it was something to the
effect that it appears Saddam is still calling the shots. Our
analysis of it is that it is basically just a reshuffle of
people who are currently serving him.
Q Can I come back to the Israeli thing for just a
second, please, John? Sorry.
MS. TUTWILER: Sure. Deportations?
Q And to the deportations.
MS. TUTWILER: Yes.
Q On the one hand, you seem to be saying --
suggesting that just because things aren't being done publicly,
that doesn't mean there isn't any progress and that the
governments are taking all -- all these governments, you said a
moment ago are taking this rather seriously because they haven't
leaked anything.
MS. TUTWILER: None of the specifics.
Q On the other hand, the Israeli government has done
something very public, which appears to run somewhat counter to
Secretary Baker's initiative.
Do you expect us to think that the Israeli government
is taking the Secretary's initiative seriously in private but is
flouting it publicly?
MS. TUTWILER: I'm certainly not trying to give that
impression, Ralph. What I'm trying to give the impression of is
the same one the Secretary did for the ten days that we were on
this trip. This is one of the most intractable problems in the
world. This is not something that is going to be solved
instantaneously, overnight by waving a magic wan. This is
something that he said would be a step-by-step process. He said
that the United States was willing to serve as a catalyst; if
the parties in the region wanted to move forward, the United
States was there.
All parties that he met with agreed that this was a
unique opportunity. All agreed we did not know how long this
opportunity would exist. This is something that he said he will
continue working on, as long as the parties in the region are
sincerely and genuinely interested. But there was not, as you
know on the trip, a literal specific at that point that he could
point to. I think at the time he used a phrase, "We've only
been at this for 6 days." Now we've been back for one week; and
last week, as I pointed out, was a very busy week, and this
isn't the only thing he's working on.
It is a very important thing. It is something the
President and the Secretary, and I believe many leaders in the
coalition in the area, are very, very interested in. But
whether you get there or not, I think that it is premature to
even make a speculation about that or to say, "Progress has been
made here or no progress." I think that we have to keep
reminding ourselves at this point in time we're at a very early
stage here. People are still discussing within their
governments some of the specific ideas that the Secretary of
State raised. I assume in due course that we will hear back
from them and maybe they will have new proposals or they'll
totally reject some or they'll accept others. And then you will
see, I think, the movement in some direction on these specific
areas. Maybe not. Maybe everybody will say, you know, no dice.
Q Margaret, aren't you giving the Israeli government
every impression that they can take their time and this is not
the time to solve the Middle East problem as promised by
President Bush himself?
MS. TUTWILER: I don't think the President promised to
solve the Middle East problem. The President said that "There
is an opportunity here, we believe. I want the United States to
act as a catalyst." That's why he sent the Secretary of State
to the region.
The Secretary of State himself was very realistic in
portraying the problems that you are dealing with, which I just
said are some of the most intractable problems in the world --
facing the world. We are committed to, provided the parties in
the region want to search for peace, acting in any way that the
United States can to help move this process along.
Everyone, where we visited, acknowledged that there was
"a window of opportunity," the phrase I heard most often, to
possibly take advantage of and see if there were opportunities
here. I can't answer for you, sir, if that's going to prove to
be fruitful or not. I don't know.
Q Margaret, could I ask you on another subject
concerning Iraq? Does the United States see any tilt on the
part of Iran toward support of the Shi'ite rebels in Iraq?
MS. TUTWILER: I really don't have anything new as far
as an update to what Richard gave to you all on Friday
concerning Iran in this situation.
As you know, we have been and will continue to follow
the matter closely. Our evidence is inconclusive. We have said
-- and Richard said this, I believe, several times last week --
that material, including arms, is undoubtedly crossing the
Iran-Iraq border. But our evidence on this is inconclusive
regarding amounts and the effect of that support.
Q Does the United States have an opinion about this?
MS. TUTWILER: The President expressed that opinion on
March 13 in Ottawa, and I'll refer you to the record instead of
re-reading it here.
The Secretary of State has spoken any number of times
concerning other countries involving themselves in the internal
affairs of Iraq. Our policy hasn't changed.
Q You have no evidence of Iranian personnel going to
Iraq? There were reports over the weekend, again, that there
were two divisions of 12,000 each having gone from Iran to Iraq.
MS. TUTWILER: I haven't seen those particular reports,
George, and I have not seen anything here at the State
Department concerning Iranian personnel, but I'll be happy to
double-check it for you.
[Iraq: Civil Unrest]
Q Margaret, do you have an update on (a) the
situation in Iraq, as it is now? And, also, do you have
anything on Kurdish claims that Iraq has been using its aircraft
to bomb them from the air?
MS. TUTWILER: I just saw that report, Jan. It was
just on the wires, I think, in the last 30 minutes. I don't
have an instant reaction for you. You know what our policy is
concerning fixed-wing aircraft. I just can't confirm it for
you. I've only seen one wire copy.
As far as an update, since Friday, fighting continues
between government forces and dissidents in both northern and
southern Iraq. In the north, government forces appear to remain
largely in control of Mosul and Kirkuk although still
hard-pressed by dissidents.
Dissident forces remain in control of large areas north
and east of these cities. Overall, levels of fighting in the
south continue to be relatively lower, but heavy fighting
occurred over the weekend in several locations in the general
area of the lower Euphrates where the government, at least
temporarily, lost control of several towns.
Q Margaret, does the United States --
MS. TUTWILER: Excuse me. I don't have anything
specific on activities in Baghdad.
Q Margaret, what sort of government does the United
States want to see emerge in Iraq?
MS. TUTWILER: The President, John, addressed himself
to that on Saturday with President Ozal. To be honest with you,
I'd just refer you to his record. He answered any number of
questions about this; basically, restating our policy, that the
Government of Iraq -- as in any other nation -- is for the Iraqi
people to determine.
He made it quite clear that it would be next to
impossible for the United States to deal with Saddam Hussein
should he remain in power. Obviously, the United States
Government, on a total hypothetical, which I've said before,
thinks the democracy model is the superior model. But we, at
the same time, are not in the business, whether it's here or
anywhere else, of telling people and dictating to people what
type of government they should have.
Q So the United States, even though it prefers a
democracy, would not have an objection if the Iraqi people
decided to continue a strong military leadership, albeit under
some other military leader other than Saddam Hussein? Is that
what you're saying?
MS. TUTWILER: It's totally hypothetical for me. I'm
going to continue to say what our policy is, that the type of
leadership of Iraq is up to the Iraqi people to determine
themselves. It will be very difficult, as the President just
stated quite clearly on Saturday, for the United States to have
any type of normal type of relations with Iraq as long as Saddam
Hussein is head of that country.
Q But the implication of what you're saying is that
we could continue to deal with a strong military leader in a
government which was not a democracy.
MS. TUTWILER: You're trying to interpret what I'm
saying to mean that.
Q That's right.
MS. TUTWILER: I'm going to continue to say that it is
up to the Iraqi people to determine their type of government and
leadership.
[Jordan: Meetings with Minister Odeh]
Q Margaret, on a related subject. I see a Foreign
Ministry official from Jordan is on the Secretary's schedule
today. What's that about?
MS. TUTWILER: As you correctly point out, the
Secretary is meeting with Mr. Abu Odeh today at 2:00 p.m. Mr.
Odeh will have a series of meetings in the Department, and he
will also meet with National Security Council Advisor Brent
Scowcroft.
Despite our deep disappointment with Jordanian
behavior during the Gulf crisis, we recognize that Jordan has a
potentially important role to play in the post-war search for
greater peace and security in the region.
The President emphasized that point in a letter to the
Congressional leadership just last week.
Mr. Odeh's visit is part of a continuing dialogue on
these subjects with the Jordanian government.
Q Are you thinking of suspending the aid?
MS. TUTWILER: The aid question is still under review.
Q Staying with Jordan. Do you have anything on
reports made last night on "60 Minutes" about Jordanian banks
being used to move Iraqi money? And if so -- or is that
something that's going to come up in the meeting with Mr. Abu
Odeh?
MS. TUTWILER: I have read Secretary Baker's agenda.
He obviously, since I've read it, can make adjustments, Jan. It
was not on his agenda to be brought up.
I saw the "60 Minutes" report yesterday. On that
specific part of the report, no, I don't have a comment.
Q Well, is the U.S. aware of the charges that this
investigator makes that up to $11 billion has been skimmed off
of the Iraqi oil revenues by Saddam and members of his family?
MS. TUTWILER: Yes.
Q And does the U.S. believe that the charges are
true?
MS. TUTWILER: Without getting into that, as you know
-- since it was your network, if you saw it last night -- at the
end of the program there was a gentleman in California -- and I
cannot remember who the United States Government officials were
who had impounded his house and I believe taken all of his cars.
So, yes, I would tell you that the United States Government is
well aware of this.
For years, Iraq has attempted to evade international
controls on items it could not import. It has used front
companies in a variety of places. You are all aware of the
arrests made last year of people operating on behalf of Iraq to
obtain capacitators and gun parts.
Through the present crisis we have worked closely with
a variety of foreign governments to prevent Iraqi attempts to
break the sanctions, whether directly or through front
companies. The Treasury Department's Office of Foreign Assets
Control keeps track of front companies, and we assist them in
working with foreign governments to stop sanctions violators.
I cannot at this point address myself to the accuracy
or inaccuracy of the figures used in the "60 Minutes" broadcast.
I just can't do those totals for you of what the assets may be
in the various front companies, nor say whether the assets might
be held for Saddam's personal use as some portions of that
broadcast alluded to, without frontally saying that they did.
Q The same investigator apparently told the
Financial Times that people acting for Saddam have bought up to
a billion dollars worth of publicly traded European securities
in the European market.
MS. TUTWILER: I don't know.
Q Margaret, does the United States have any sense of
how many Iraqis may be fleeing to U.S. held southern Iraq?
MS. TUTWILER: I don't have a number for you. You
might check at the Pentagon. I just don't know.
Q And does the State Department have a policy about
how long it should stay there for humanitarian reasons to feed
or give medical --
MS. TUTWILER: Stay where? In southern Iraq?
Q Yes.
MS. TUTWILER: Our policy, as you know, Johanna, is
that as soon as there is a cease-fire -- which we do not have a
cease-fire resolution -- and if that cease-fire, is my
understanding, is implemented, then you would have United States
troops withdrawing. So we are not there, number one,
for humanitarian purposes to feed fleeing Iraqi soldiers. We
are there for a totally different purpose, and there is no
cease-fire resolution as of today.
In fact, I could bring you up to speed. Over the
weekend, the members of the Permanent Five met informally -- I
believe only on Saturday. They're meeting again today to work
on this resolution, and, as I mentioned, the Secretary himself
is involved and has been involved, talking to his counterparts
about it.
Q Just one more thing: Is there anything on -- you
don't see anything on the ground in southern Iraq that would
delay a U.N. cease-fire?
MS. TUTWILER: Not that I know of. No.
Q Margaret, in the same line, I've heard reports
from General Schwarzkopf that we're planning a permanent
presence in the area, not including the U.S. ground soldiers.
Can you expand on that? Are we planning, indeed, on a permanent
presence in the area, particularly in Bahrain?
MS. TUTWILER: Well, I think what you're talking about,
sir, is CENTCOM presence. As you know, we've had a permanent
naval presence since 1949, and our policy concerning ground
troops, there is no change in that whatsoever, and Marlin has
again addressed himself to this this morning.
But concerning a CENTCOM facility, that is something
for those of you who traveled with us know that Secretary Baker
brought up in many of his conversations on his most recent trip
as one of the things that could be looked at in a possible
regional security type of arrangement. And that is something
that is being discussed right now.
I will not be country specific, but I would like to be
very clear on what is being discussed, which is not a
headquarters unit -- not moving CENTCOM, where I believe its
headquarters is Tampa, Florida, and this would not be ground
forces.
Q Margaret, a follow-up to the story about the
Saddam finances. Is the U.S. Government giving help to the
Kuwaitis tracking the finances of Iraq in order to prepare
themselves for the reparations and all that?
MS. TUTWILER: The United States Government has been
giving help and the fact, as I said, by making sure that we do
our part to enforce U.N. sanctions. That is the way that I'm
aware of that we have -- if you want to characterize it as
helpful. We have been very vigilant, as you know, since August
2 and whenever the various economic sanctions were passed, in
making sure that we as a country did our part, that there were
no sanctions busters, and that we did everything we could to
enforce sanctions.
Q Could I try to be more precise. The story of the
"60 Minutes" yesterday was putting emphasis on a kind of private
investigator. Is the U.S. Government doing kind of the same job
to the Kuwaitis?
MS. TUTWILER: The United States Government is not
doing this privately. We are doing this publicly, as you know,
through our Foreign Assets Control Office at the Treasury
Department.
Q Margaret, can you tell us anything more about
Baker's conversation with Bessmertnykh, either on the U.N.
resolution or on other subjects?
MS. TUTWILER: No. To be honest with you, I only heard
him say this morning that he was going to call these three
foreign ministers on the U.N. resolution, and all I did before I
came to brief was ask if he completed the call. So I can't be
of any help.
Q Any further movement on the CFE question?
MS. TUTWILER: Not that I know of.
Q Has that been discussed since the Secretary was
there?
MS. TUTWILER: Not that I know of, Bill. His call
today was specifically U.N. resolution-related. I will ask,
when I have a chance to spend some time with him, if he indeed
took the occasion to bring up CFE.
Q Coming back for a moment to John's question of the
kind of government the United States seeks, you answered about
how hypothetically the United States would prefer to see a
democracy, but you're not in the business of telling anybody how
to -- what kind of government to have.
MS. TUTWILER: Right.
Q Does the movement of U.S. tanks into Iraq --
further into Iraq over the weekend have any relationship to
telling people what kind of government they ought to have or
what kind of government they ought not to have?
MS. TUTWILER: I'm not in the position, Ralph, here to
confirm or deny that, so I would refer that part of your
question to the Pentagon. I'm just not up to speed on that.
Q But if those -- if other U.S. Government officials
confirm that, would that be consistent with the U.S. opinion
that it doesn't try to tell another government what it ought to
be or another country what kind of government it ought to have
or not have?
MS. TUTWILER: I have refrained since January 16 of
answering any questions that I view as military operational
questions, and I am not -- or cannot start today going down that
avenue of why, if it's true, tanks were moved to another
location. That in my mind is pure military and pure
operational.
Q It has no political implications whatsoever.
MS. TUTWILER: It's an operational military question in
my mind.
Q Margaret, if I could just nail down --
MS. TUTWILER: Beat it to death. (Laughter)
Q No. I'd like to try to nail down --
MS. TUTWILER: Go for it!
Q -- nail it down with some specificity. If the
United States has no opinion as to what sort of government the
-- I'm sorry, let me rephrase that. If the United States feels
it's up to the Iraqi people to select their own government, does
that mean that the United States has no intention of intervening
militarily on the side of one faction or the other in Iraq?
[Iraq: US Position on Future Government]
MS. TUTWILER: That would certainly be every indication
I would have gotten from our President. And since there is so
much interest in this -- maybe you didn't see his press
conference on Saturday -- I will briefly read for you what the
President said.
"I don't think it is for us to see what will follow on
in Iraq. All I've done is state that it will be very difficult
for the United States -- in fact, at this juncture, I'd say
impossible -- to have normalized relations with Iraq with Saddam
Hussein in power."
He continues: "I think it would be inappropriate to
try to shape or suggest, even, what government should follow on.
I would hope that it would be one that could work very
compatibly with the Western powers, Western countries, and live
happily ever after without threatening its neighbors."
Q Margaret, to go back to Ralph's question about the
conversation between Mr. Baker and Mr. Bessmertnykh --
MS. TUTWILER: I don't know anything about it.
Q I know. But let me just follow. TASS is
reporting that Ambassador Matlock this morning met with
President Gorbachev and gave him a letter from President Bush.
Can you give any details on that meeting?
MS. TUTWILER: I have no idea that, (1) there was a
meeting, or (2) that there is a letter from President Bush to
President Gorbachev. I'll check at the White House for you.
[Israel: Arrest/Extradition of American Citizens]
Q And a totally different subject: Do you have
anything on the extradition of two American Israelis connected
with the murder of Alex Odeh in Los Angeles some years ago?
MS. TUTWILER: Are you talking about Robert and
Rochelle Manning?
Q I am indeed.
MS. TUTWILER: Robert and Rochelle Manning were
arrested at their home on Sunday, March 24. They are wanted for
causing an explosive bomb to be delivered with the intent to
kill or injure another. This case involves the death of
Patricia Wilkerson. We have requested their extradition from
Israel, and we are working closely with the Government of
Israel. Any other questions I have to refer you to the
Department of Justice.
Q When was Patricia Wilkerson killed and where?
MS. TUTWILER: I don't know, Jim. I was told, to be
perfectly honest with you, that I would be asked this question,
and this is -- with everything else going on this morning, this
is all I got on it from the lawyers. I'll be happy to get all
the information from the Legal Office.
Q Does the U.S. expect the Government of Japan to
make up the difference or so-called shortfall between the value
of its contribution as stated at the time in dollars and the
value now that the dollar has risen against the yen?
MS. TUTWILER: I just saw one wire copy, Bill, briefly
before I came out here. I'll have to ask the experts who would
obviously be in a better position than I am than just to guess
for you. I don't know.
Q Same general subject: I think the German Finance
Minister is in town to talk about the status of Germany's
pledge. I understand there's some difference of opinion on
that. Perhaps the Secretary has a meeting, I believe, tomorrow.
MS. TUTWILER: Tomorrow. Tomorrow he's seeing him.
Q Do you have any guidance there on this subject?
MS. TUTWILER: No. And I know that the same experts
who have been working this subject throughout the crisis are
still working the issue. Not just German specific, George. I
mean the whole, entire thing. And so there is no answer for you
today on any part of this. As you know, this has always been a
little tricky on getting all of these numbers, etc., and from my
brief conversation this morning with one of the experts who sits
on these meetings, I just don't have an answer for you.
[Cambodia: Reported Arms for the Khmer Rouge ]
Q Another subject matter, if I may: Is the United
States arming the Khmer Rouge? There's some charges made today.
MS. TUTWILER: No. Those charges have been made
before. We see them from time to time. There is no truth
whatsoever to this charge. As we have stated repeatedly, the
United States has never supplied any weapons or other lethal
military aid to any Cambodian faction. Our assistance to the
non-Communist resistance has always consisted of non-lethal
support, such as tents, uniforms and food.
Moreover, we have never provided any assistance to the
Khmer Rouge, and we have taken great pains to ensure that none
of our non-lethal assistance to the NCR has been diverted to the
Khmer Rouge.
Q Some arms were paraded in public.
MS. TUTWILER: I don't know. I know that this comes up
from time to time, or it has while I've been at the State
Department, and this is consistently what our policy has been in
the Bush Administration. And, as I said, we take great pains to
ensure that none of our non-lethal assistance gets into the
hands of the Khmer Rouge.
Q Is there any specific reason for amending your
travel advisory to Colombia?
MS. TUTWILER: I don't know. I know that it's been
amended, and I don't know what went into the thinking there.
I'll ask the experts for you.
Q Back on Israel. Did the Israelis respond to the
U.S. protest, giving any justification for the deportations?
MS. TUTWILER: Ambassador Kelly did not characterize
for me this morning Ambassador Shoval's response, and I do not
know yet who Ambassador Brown met with. So I cannot say that I
have a specific Israeli response.
Q And in these meetings, did the U.S. side raise
this proposal for new housing in the Occupied Territories for
Soviet emigres?
MS. TUTWILER: No. As you know, in the agreement that
was made -- I believe it was like two weeks ago -- that will not
be brought up, it's my understanding, until September.
Q On the same subject, a long shot. Since the
language that you used on this deportation, it seems a little
stronger than some previous ones.
MS. TUTWILER: Not to me.
Q It seemed a little stronger to me. I wonder
whether it's safe for us to assume that one of the
confidence-building measures that the Secretary may have
suggested was an end to deportation.
MS. TUTWILER: That is a long shot, because not that I
would not be pleased to answer it for you, but it unfortunately
opens up a subject matter that the Secretary himself has refused
to answer any questions concerning any of the specifics that he
has discussed, not only with the Israeli government but any
other governments in the area. So I cannot answer the question
for you.
Q But he did make very specific suggestions, did he,
on this visit?
MS. TUTWILER: Yes. And he has revealed, as Bill can
attest to -- Johanna, Ralph, etc. -- zero of them. Nor has so
far any of the --
Q (Inaudible) -- I'm writing.
MS. TUTWILER: I know. So, yes, he has not addressed
himself to them, literally, so far.
[South Africa: Renewed Violence]
Q Margaret, can I just bring up an area that we're
always being accused of ignoring, and that is -- we, the press,
that is -- South Africa. Have you got any comment on the
clashes and the violence?
MS. TUTWILER: Yes. We deplore the police killings.
The responsibility to preserve public order cannot be an
occasion for killing civilians. This sort of reaction is an
unacceptable vestige of the old South Africa. We call on the
South African government to fully investigate this incident, and
we urge President de Klerk to do all he can to ensure that the
police carry out their duties in a professional and unbiased
fashion.
Q Have you made any representation of this to the
South African government.
MS. TUTWILER: I'm sure.
Q I see that Ambassador -- what's his name --
Schwarz is coming in this afternoon to see Mr. Cohen. Is that
going to be on the agenda?
MS. TUTWILER: You know something that I don't know.
I'm not aware that the South African Ambassador's coming in.
I'm sure that, Jan, this has been raised through our Embassy
personnel there in South Africa.
Q Thank you.
MS. TUTWILER: Thank you all.
(The briefing concluded at 12:45 p.m.) (###)