US Department of State Daily Briefing #35:
Tuesday, 3/5/91
Tutwiler
Source: State Department Spokesman Margaret Tutwiler
Description: 12:14 PM, Washington, DC
Date: Mar 5, 19913/5/91
Category: Briefings
Region: MidEast/North Africa, East Asia, Eurasia,
South America, Subsaharan Africa
Country: Israel, Iraq, Kuwait, Iran
Subject: Military Affairs, Human Rights,
Development/Relief Aid, Regional/Civil Unrest,
Security Assistance and Sales
(ON THE RECORD UNLESS OTHERWISE NOTED)
[Iraq: Civil Unrest]
. MS. TUTWILER: To do a little bit further on what the
Secretary had just said to you all concerning the unrest in
southern Iraq: As he stated, yes, we do continue to receive
numerous reports of civil unrest. He had mentioned, he thought,
there may be four or five cities. We believe there may be as
many as nine cities mentioned in various different reports. As
he stated, our information is still very limited, but we believe
that there is indeed unrest in a number of these locations.
The Iraqi government has been employing Republican
Guards, regular army, people's militia, who are also known as
the Popular Army, and police units in efforts to suppress this
activity. It may have restored government control in a few of
the affected areas. We cannot confirm that there has been any
unrest in Baghdad. However, in an unusual development, Radio
Baghdad and the Iraqi News Agency, INA, seem to have gone off
the air for approximately one hour earlier this morning, but we
do not know why.
Q Margaret, these reports still make it hard to
figure out where the Administration comes down. I mean, you
guys have been calling for the overthrow of Saddam Hussein for
weeks now, but the reports are that the people who may be
overthrowing Saddam Hussein are possibly Iranian-sponsored
fundamentalists.
Can you tell me now, or maybe later if you can't now,
does the Administration come down on the side of unrest? Are
you happy with what's going on, because it may mean the end of
Saddam Hussein, or would you like to see order restored and
proper elections held as the Ambassador in Kuwait seemed to
suggest in that country? Where are you on this?
MS. TUTWILER: We're where we've always been. Number
one, you said that the Administration has been calling for weeks
for the overthrow of Saddam Hussein. I would characterize it a
little differently. I recall the President saying, when asked
this question, that he would not shed any tears. Also, the
President has said that, as in all countries, this is a decision
for the Iraqi people themselves to make.
The Secretary of State said to you yesterday that,
obviously, it makes it a lot easier on that country if they have
a different leadership, but that is up to the people of that
country.
As far as any Iranian involvement, the Secretary just
addressed himself to that We have read these reports, but we
have nothing -- or are not in a position to confirm that for you
all at this time.
Q Well, in your messages to Iran, are you doing
anything about this? You've opened almost a regular dialogue.
MS. TUTWILER: We don't know if there's anything to do
right now, Barry. All we've seen are reports. I mean, what are
we supposed to call them about?
Q No, I mean -- no. The war has caused the
Administration to bring Syria and Iran into its regular cycle
now of diplomatic contacts. It's gone past the war now. You
immediately send a message to the Swiss for the Iranians to tell
them about this, tell them about that.
In these exchanges, have you asked the Iranians if
they're involved in this unrest, or have you asked them to stop
it if they are?
MS. TUTWILER: Those messages, as you know, were passed
at the beginning of the air campaign and the beginning of the
ground war. These reports of Iranian participation or Iranian
instigation or Iranian involvement in some of the unrest in some
of these locations -- we are not in a position to confirm or
deny or verify or tell you that we know this at all.
So, no, I do not believe a message has been sent
through our third party, the Swiss. That is a question that
would be addressed in the future should evidence come in. I'm
assuming, Barry, that there is something like that going on, but
right now we don't have that evidence.
Q Margaret, any further messages with the Iranians
since --
MS. TUTWILER: Excuse me?
Q Have there been any further messages to or from
the Iranians since the one that was sent at the end of -- with
the President's declaration of the end of the war?
MS. TUTWILER: I believe that is the last one, Ralph.
That is the last meeting that I know of -- when Under Secretary
Kimmitt met with the Swiss Ambassador.
Q Margaret, how would the United States feel about
Iranian involvement with an insurrection in southern Iraq?
MS. TUTWILER: We have said that the United States
respects and believes in the territorial integrity of Iraq, and
we do not believe that other states should involve themselves in
the internal matters of Iraq, and that other states should
refrain from interfering in Iraq's internal affairs.
Q Margaret, do you have anything on the journalists?
MS. TUTWILER: No. We're aware of the reports. I
don't have anything specific. I've seen various wire copy
stories this morning listing various individuals, but I have not
officially heard from any news organization; here at the State
Department, we have not. I do not know if your organizations
are telling the White House or the Pentagon or CENTCOM, but we
have not been notified officially this morning by any American
news organizations.
Q Is the United States doing anything to encourage
pro-democracy movements in Iraq?
MS. TUTWILER: The United States, as you know,
obviously, supports the democratic model throughout the world
and in all countries, and the United States also believes it's
up to the people of each nation to choose their own leadership
and their own type of government.
Q Margaret, the President actually said recently
that it would be -- he'd like it if the Iraqi people took it
into their own hands, I think was his phrase. Does the U.S.
believe that what's going on in Iraq now is the Iraqi people
taking it into their own hands?
MS. TUTWILER: Let me go back to what I said. We
crafted it, obviously, very carefully. I said that there are
indications of unrest in maybe as many as nine locations. I
also said that the Iraqi government has been employing the
Republican Guards, the regular army, people's militia and police
units in efforts to suppress this activity and may have restored
government control in a few of the affected areas that we are
talking about. So I think that it is premature, Ralph, to say
that the people have taken things into their own hands.
Q Margaret, does the U.S. believe that in some of
those areas the government had lost control?
MS. TUTWILER: We don't have that type of analytical
work yet to be able to give you a very good, thorough analysis
of it.
Q Margaret, yesterday a Pentagon briefer seemed to
be indicating that there were Republican Guards fighting regular
army units. He determined this by the kinds of tanks
that they were using. Your statement seems to indicate that all
the Iraqi forces were on one side against some sort of
uprising. Is that what you mean to tell us?
MS. TUTWILER: I'm not familiar with -- I'm sorry, I
missed the Pentagon briefing yesterday -- exactly what they
said. I'm telling you -- there's been, what, 12 hours since
that briefing -- what our latest assessment is of the situation.
I do not have for you who's fighting whom and if tanks are
fighting tanks.
Q Well, let me just follow up. Do you know of any
army or Republican Guards or any other regular units who are
fighting the Iraqi government?
MS. TUTWILER: Of my own knowledge, no, I couldn't get
into that level of detail for you.
Q Is Radio Baghdad back on the air?
MS. TUTWILER: My understanding, yes, is that they only
were off the air for one hour, and we have no explanation of
why.
Q When was that, do you know?
MS. TUTWILER: I don't have the time.
Q Can I turn to Kuwait for just a second, Margaret?
MS. TUTWILER: Sure.
Q The situation in Kuwait does appear to be fairly
chaotic at the moment. We asked you a few questions about this
yesterday. Is the apparent chaos in Kuwait anything for which
the United States or a coalition should feel responsible? Does
it in any way interfere with Secretary Baker's effort to move
quickly to restore stability in the region? Does it send any
kind of messages to other Arab nations about how the situation
might evolve in the Gulf?
MS. TUTWILER: One, I'm not sure that I subscribe to
your characterization of the situation in Kuwait City as
chaotic. I personally happen to have spoken to our Ambassador,
Skip Gnehm, yesterday in Kuwait City. I had a very lengthy
conversation with him and that is not how he described the
situation, quite frankly. He described more the lack of power,
the lack of water, that the jubilation that is still going on in
the streets there that I'm sure everyone has seen on their own
TV screens. He did not describe this as a chaotic situation to
me, to be fair.
Also, as you know, the Crown Prince arrived back there
yesterday. It is my understanding that the majority of the
ministers of the Kuwaiti government have returned. The Crown
Prince is there, as you know, acting in his normal capacity as
Prime Minister of Kuwait, and the Amir has asked him to take on
the new task of being the Military Governor General.
All of the key ministers who are involved with security
and reconstruction are back in place. And, as I said yesterday
and as the Secretary said today, this is going to take some
time. Yes, there is devastation. There is a lack of normal
communication and lack of facilities, but I am not sure that I
would subscribe to the characterization that it's just total
chaos there.
Q There are some reports likewise, however, though,
of groups engaging in revenge killings and seeking out people
who might opposed the Amir's government or the form of
government that he previously had in Kuwait. What do you make
of those reports, and what do you make of the reports about
suppression of those attempts to suggest another form of
government there?
MS. TUTWILER: I don't think that I have anything
further or further information to impart today than we had
yesterday. And, as we stated yesterday, we have raised the
issues of suppression of others with the Kuwaiti government in
exile. The Crown Prince, Ralph, upon arrival in his country
yesterday publicly addressed himself to this. I'll refer you to
his remarks.
I also should note today that, as you all know, Kuwait
is under a three-month period of martial law while the
government re-establishes its civil authority. Security, which
you all asked me about yesterday, is presently the
responsibility of the Kuwaiti army, with the cooperation of the
Kuwaiti police as well as the resistance. This arrangement is a
temporary measure until the Kuwaiti police can be fully
reconstituted.
Q Is it still the U.S. view that the Amir has not
come back because his house may still be booby-trapped, or might
there be political reasons why he's not returning?
MS. TUTWILER: If they're political, I haven't heard
those mentioned yet. The last reasons that I've heard are the
ones I stated yesterday concerning safety and security.
Q Margaret, I think yesterday you spoke of reports
of reprisals against Palestinian Arabs in Kuwait.
A Yes, a few incidents.
Q O.K., a few incidents. Now it sounds like they're
more than reports. Are those the people who are being
suppressed -- are they among the people?
A I thought that's what Ralph was asking me.
Q No -- all right, I know, and I'm trying to pick up
where Ralph left off because yesterday you spoke in terms of
reports. To me, when you say reports, it may mean you read it
in a newspaper. Now that you've spoken to the Ambassador, can
you verify that the monarchy -- you know, the ousted people who
you've helped back into power -- are beating up on Palestinians
for allegedly being sympathetic or maybe even really being
sympathetic to the Iraqis?
MS. TUTWILER: This is certainly not something that was
raised in my conversation with the Ambassador there on the
ground, and our views are the same as the ones we expressed
yesterday. And, again, I would also point out that it is my
understanding -- I don't have the text with me -- that the Crown
Prince himself, upon arrival back in his country, spoke to this
very issue.
Q Not to beat it to death, but yesterday you spoke
of reports of reprisals. Does the State Department --
MS. TUTWILER: That's still what I have today.
Q Does the State Department know only --
MS. TUTWILER: No.
Q -- only of reports or does it know of actual
reprisals?
MS. TUTWILER: I do not know myself of an actual
reprisal, actual suppression, actual incident.
Q Nor was it raised with the Ambassador to do
something -- to counsel them not to do this, if this is true.
MS. TUTWILER: In my particular conversation yesterday,
it did not have anything to do with this subject. I am
(inaudible) Assistant Secretary for this bureau; I was
discussing other matters.
Q (Inaudible) the whole building, not just you.
MS. TUTWILER: Well, I'm not the only person that he
talks to.
Q I'm just wondering -- he made a nice pro-democracy
speech yesterday --
MS. TUTWILER: Yes.
Q -- we see in the papers. And I just wondered if
the State Department has asked its man on the scene to see that
Palestinians aren't beaten up in Kuwait.
MS. TUTWILER: Of course. I said that yesterday. I
said we had discussions. He's been our Ambassador, Barry, as
you know, living both in Riyadh and Taif, for many, many weeks
and months, as I remember -- and so I had said yesterday that
these conversations had gone on with the government in exile.
So that's prior to their getting here.
Now, what I cannot answer -- I think he's only been
back -- what? -- two and a half days -- if there has been a
reason for Skip to raise this since he's been on the ground.
Q Can I just ask a question of representation to the
Kuwaiti government? The U.S. Ambassador is now in Kuwait City.
Presumably, his contacts are with the Crown Prince --
MS. TUTWILER: Yes.
Q -- and the other ministers who are present in
Kuwait City. Does that mean that the United States now
essentially is conducting its business with the Government of
Kuwait through those officials of the Government of Kuwait who
are present in Kuwait City, and could we then draw the
conclusion that Secretary Baker would likewise conduct his
business with those who are present in Kuwait City?
MS. TUTWILER: I don't have an answer for you
concerning Secretary Baker, if you're asking me about a
scheduling question concerning his trip. But, yes, you can
assume that our Ambassador there on the ground is certainly
dealing -- in fact, I think he had a very public meeting
yesterday -- with the Crown Prince. And he has continued
throughout this week, when different ministers get back and
their staffs get up and running, to meet with them there in
Kuwait City.
Q And to follow that then, who, if anyone, from the
U.S. Government is maintaining relations with the Amir of Kuwait
who is not in Kuwait?
MS. TUTWILER: I don't have an answer to that, Ralph,
but I assume, just like in our government, if Secretary of State
Baker is traveling and the President is here or the President is
traveling, there are ways that bureaucracies and staffs and
individuals can communicate. So if we have a message for the
Amir, I'm sure that our Ambassador there either calls the staff
that is with the Amir in Taif or passes it -- whatever the
message is -- through one of the ministries that he is dealing
with. That's not that unusual.
Q Do you have anything on the Iraqi annulment of the
annexation of Kuwait, which occurred a few minutes before you
came out here?
MS. TUTWILER: I saw the one wire copy -- correct -- a
few minutes before I came out here, and we don't have any
comment yet --
Q Margaret --
MS. TUTWILER: -- other than, George, I would say --
speaking speculatively -- if it is the same group that passed
the one in August annexing Kuwait -- if it's the same group, if
it's doing or has done what the United Nations called for, then
obviously we would welcome it.
Q Margaret, I wasn't here yesterday, so --
MS. TUTWILER: It's O.K.
Q -- if this covers that, skip it.
Can you tell us how active the Soviets have been in
securing the release of American POWs, and also outline for us
the contacts between the U.S. and the Soviets -- if there are
any -- in an effort to find out who is in charge in Baghdad and
just the status of the government there?
MS. TUTWILER: As we've said all week long, we assume
that Saddam Hussein is in charge in Baghdad. There have not been
any Soviet contacts at the Secretary of State level.
And the first part of your question was concerning
POWs? I'm not aware of anything specific that we have done,
Mark. I think that any number of nations throughout this entire
thing, if you go back to -- remember human shields and hostages?
-- have all been using any avenue of influence that they have to
get Saddam Hussein to release people. But I'm not aware of some
specific message that we've recently sent concerning POWs. You
know yourself the Soviets have been out on the record saying so,
that they raise this issue of POWs in every one of the meetings
they had with Tariq Aziz in Moscow.
Q Margaret, can you give us an update on the subject
of incubators? The reason I ask is that you remember reports
from very early on that many incubators have been taken by the
Iraqis --
MS. TUTWILER: Yes.
Q -- then later you called on them to return
incubators --
MS. TUTWILER: And airplanes and other things.
Q -- and airplanes and other things. And then some
people have said, when they've gotten back into Kuwait, that
there are incubators in the hospitals; but now, sadly, there has
been the discovery of a large mass grave of very young infants.
So I wonder: What do you think happened with the
incubators; and do you think, indeed, those early reports were
true that many of them were just --
MS. TUTWILER: I don't know. I haven't heard about a
mass grave. I know it's not only -- we have called for, the
United Nations has called for -- it has said so in their most
recent resolution, 686 -- that they must return the property
that they took from Kuwait to Iraq. I guess that includes
airplanes, incubators, et cetera.
I haven't heard that any of that, (l) that the Iraqis
have accepted and said they're going to do that; or that any
equipment or material in their possession is moving back. I
just don't know.
Q But the U.S. Government then did not ever really
verify these reports that many, many incubators were taken away?
MS. TUTWILER: As I remember it, I believe it was the
people who were in Kuwait City at the time who were saying this.
I'm not sure that at the time we had ways and means to verify
it, and I have to assume we had no reason to doubt it. But I
will be happy to see if there's anything else we know further
about it.
Q Margaret, on the trip, can you say whether the
Secretary, when in the Soviet Union, will meet with Baltic
leaders? Are there any plans?
MS. TUTWILER: No. We're still working on any number
of details. In fact, to be honest, when we're leaving, that's
back up in the air -- what order we're going in, who we're going
to see -- so I just have to ask you to bear with us a little bit
longer. We're still working on the details.
Q And this won't be settled after the briefing, I
take it. This is not like yesterday. I mean you don't have a
tentative reschedule --?
MS. TUTWILER: No. I don't have any firm answers to
give when we finish.
Q They were tentative yesterday, but do you have any
today?
MS. TUTWILER: They were tentative yesterday. They're
even more tentative today.
Q I'm ON BACKGROUND, by the way!
MS. TUTWILER: That's O.K., Barry.
(Laughter.)
[US Supplementary Aid for Israel]
Q Has the Department made a decision on a
supplemental aid request for Israel?
MS. TUTWILER: No. Those discussions, in fact, are
continuing today. Those discussions have been going on since we
received the request. The discussions continue, but none of the
details am I at liberty to divulge.
We have been going back and forth on this. As many of
you may or may not know, the Secretary of State had a meeting
here Saturday with the Israeli Ambassador. Deputy Secretary of
State Eagleburger has had a number of phone calls with the
Israeli Ambassador since the Saturday meeting, which he too
attended, as did OMB Director Dick Darman.
Q Does that mean you deny today's story in The Post?
MS. TUTWILER: The parts of the story -- I can't
remember which parts you're asking me; I can't deny or confirm
an entire piece. But the parts of the story, as I remember
reading it very early this morning concerning a Saturday
meeting, I've just confirmed for you. I've confirmed the
participants in that meeting.
What I'm not going to do is confirm any of the
substance of those conversations.
Q Margaret, do you have anything on the elections in
Bangladesh?
MS. TUTWILER: No. Unfortunately, I don't. Sorry.
Q Can you take the question?
MS. TUTWILER: Sure.
Q Thank you.
MS. TUTWILER: Thanks.
(The briefing concluded at l2:35 p.m.)